<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/" > <channel><title>Comments on: The Risk of Automatically Paying Your Bills</title> <atom:link href="http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/#utm_source=rss&amp;utm_medium=rss&amp;utm_campaign=the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills</link> <description>A personal finance blog teaching you how to live debt free and use credit wisely.</description> <lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Sep 2010 14:46:26 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=abc</generator> <item><title>By: Kevin</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-16166</link> <dc:creator>Kevin</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 14:31:03 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-16166</guid> <description>@DYDR?: Good companies do flush them out -- but I think your 1,000s of vendors example points more toward not running is separate groups and more toward one central hub. Every business is different of course.Incompetence or ignorance should be seen in nearly the same light as malicious intent. I&#039;ll stop doing business with stupid businesses. :)@TStrump: I do get e-mail reminders that my bill has come in, but I think the simple step of making me log in (maybe I&#039;m at work, maybe I&#039;m busy) can be a deterrent. I wish they would put the bill amount or bill summary in the e-mail.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@DYDR?: Good companies do flush them out &#8212; but I think your 1,000s of vendors example points more toward not running is separate groups and more toward one central hub. Every business is different of course.</p><p>Incompetence or ignorance should be seen in nearly the same light as malicious intent. I&#8217;ll stop doing business with stupid businesses. <img src='http://cdn.nodebtplan.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p><p>@TStrump: I do get e-mail reminders that my bill has come in, but I think the simple step of making me log in (maybe I&#8217;m at work, maybe I&#8217;m busy) can be a deterrent. I wish they would put the bill amount or bill summary in the e-mail.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: TStrump</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15900</link> <dc:creator>TStrump</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 31 Mar 2009 04:46:37 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15900</guid> <description>I prefer electronic billing but if you&#039;re not careful, it&#039;s easy to forget if you don&#039;t see a piece of paper. Most companies do offer an email reminder, though. When I get my ebills, I immediately enter them into my software to remind me to pay them on time.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I prefer electronic billing but if you&#8217;re not careful, it&#8217;s easy to forget if you don&#8217;t see a piece of paper.<br /> Most companies do offer an email reminder, though.<br /> When I get my ebills, I immediately enter them into my software to remind me to pay them on time.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Do You Dave Ramsey?</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15749</link> <dc:creator>Do You Dave Ramsey?</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 29 Mar 2009 18:44:40 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15749</guid> <description>Hey Kevin, this is great discussion and we&#039;re on the same page at the end of the day... I personally have most of my bills set up as autopay and I tie that back to a budget every month.As for businesses being run as cost centers... hmmm, that&#039;s a big one and I don&#039;t see that changing.  Controls and accountability factors should be put into place and cost line items should be rationalized across units but this doesn&#039;t happen as often as we&#039;d like to thing.I worked with a client that was rationalizing all of their external vendors - they had 1000s of them, many of which were performing similar functions but for different operating units.  By simply shortening the vendor list by 20-30% they were able to save millions of dollars by getting better deals by becoming larger customers to the remaining vendors.Another plant I spent time at was able reduce costs by grouping orders even when going to the same vendor...Big business does allow for lower costs but there are ineffiencies in the proess too.  Good companies flush these out - Walmart is a great example - but not all do...I realize that this discussion carries us well off your original topic but my point is to be careful when looking for ways that companies are &#039;out to get you&#039;.  98 out of 100 times it&#039;ll be incompetence or ignorance rather than malicious intent.... and most of this is the result of their own heft.Thanks for the discussion and long live personal accountability!Dave</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Kevin, this is great discussion and we&#8217;re on the same page at the end of the day&#8230; I personally have most of my bills set up as autopay and I tie that back to a budget every month.</p><p>As for businesses being run as cost centers&#8230; hmmm, that&#8217;s a big one and I don&#8217;t see that changing.  Controls and accountability factors should be put into place and cost line items should be rationalized across units but this doesn&#8217;t happen as often as we&#8217;d like to thing.</p><p>I worked with a client that was rationalizing all of their external vendors &#8211; they had 1000s of them, many of which were performing similar functions but for different operating units.  By simply shortening the vendor list by 20-30% they were able to save millions of dollars by getting better deals by becoming larger customers to the remaining vendors.</p><p>Another plant I spent time at was able reduce costs by grouping orders even when going to the same vendor&#8230;</p><p>Big business does allow for lower costs but there are ineffiencies in the proess too.  Good companies flush these out &#8211; Walmart is a great example &#8211; but not all do&#8230;</p><p>I realize that this discussion carries us well off your original topic but my point is to be careful when looking for ways that companies are &#8216;out to get you&#8217;.  98 out of 100 times it&#8217;ll be incompetence or ignorance rather than malicious intent&#8230;. and most of this is the result of their own heft.</p><p>Thanks for the discussion and long live personal accountability!</p><p>Dave</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Kevin</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15747</link> <dc:creator>Kevin</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 29 Mar 2009 18:16:41 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15747</guid> <description>@Corporate Barbarian: Yea I&#039;ve heard of parents having to &quot;bail out&quot; their kids from text message services. Good thing you caught it.@Abigail: That&#039;s a decent idea (making payments every time you get paid). But I suppose it would depend on whether or not your service provider would let you do just that.@Baker: Thanks!@Do You Dave Ramsey: Actually I do like electronic billing, but I think there is a risk involved. I see your point from the business perspective - but - and this is a big but - should firms be managed as cost centers? Why not look at the firm as a whole in terms of costs and say hey marketing department, cut down on your paper, too.We definitely agree on personal accountability -- something that I think is sorely lacking in our society. And hey, I love when people disagree. Seriously -- it makes me challenge my own assumptions and conclusions. I have been known to change my mind every once in a blue moon.@Busy Mom: Glad you agreed -- thanks for stopping by!@barnegat84: Wow I hadn&#039;t thought of what would happen if our computer(s) died and we were unable to access our bills. I suppose I could do it at work, but for those that don&#039;t use computers at work (or are not allowed to) the library or a friend&#039;s computer would be the only option. Thanks for bringing this up.@Jamillah: Wow I don&#039;t think I would let $244 ride on anything. I&#039;d fight for that -- it&#039;d be worth the 30 minutes or an hour I had to pour into it.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Corporate Barbarian: Yea I&#8217;ve heard of parents having to &#8220;bail out&#8221; their kids from text message services. Good thing you caught it.</p><p>@Abigail: That&#8217;s a decent idea (making payments every time you get paid). But I suppose it would depend on whether or not your service provider would let you do just that.</p><p>@Baker: Thanks!</p><p>@Do You Dave Ramsey: Actually I do like electronic billing, but I think there is a risk involved. I see your point from the business perspective &#8211; but &#8211; and this is a big but &#8211; should firms be managed as cost centers? Why not look at the firm as a whole in terms of costs and say hey marketing department, cut down on your paper, too.</p><p>We definitely agree on personal accountability &#8212; something that I think is sorely lacking in our society. And hey, I love when people disagree. Seriously &#8212; it makes me challenge my own assumptions and conclusions. I have been known to change my mind every once in a blue moon.</p><p>@Busy Mom: Glad you agreed &#8212; thanks for stopping by!</p><p>@barnegat84: Wow I hadn&#8217;t thought of what would happen if our computer(s) died and we were unable to access our bills. I suppose I could do it at work, but for those that don&#8217;t use computers at work (or are not allowed to) the library or a friend&#8217;s computer would be the only option. Thanks for bringing this up.</p><p>@Jamillah: Wow I don&#8217;t think I would let $244 ride on anything. I&#8217;d fight for that &#8212; it&#8217;d be worth the 30 minutes or an hour I had to pour into it.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Jamillah</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15605</link> <dc:creator>Jamillah</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 12:33:06 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15605</guid> <description>You are right. I am a former WAMU costumer who had their payment set up on my for my card, then they switch to Chase. I was told that I was late, pay $244 in all and had my credit line reduce by $300. I was so mad but I let it ride. I was never late during my time with WAMU so I could have fought the charges. I was more upset that someone from India (with a bad attitude) calling me from a New Jersey number for Chase. The same for my Comcast bill...I was paying that on-line but I was receiving snail mail bills. If I wasn&#039;t on time with my payment they were going to put added charges onto the bill. I put that on automatic bill pay so I know that it is paid on time. I also make sure that I look at the online notice bill, make the proper payments and set it to pay before the due date. That way I know that it is applied to my bill. They are trying to get more money from you no matter what. We have to be diligent on stopping them!</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are right. I am a former WAMU costumer who had their payment set up on my for my card, then they switch to Chase. I was told that I was late, pay $244 in all and had my credit line reduce by $300. I was so mad but I let it ride. I was never late during my time with WAMU so I could have fought the charges. I was more upset that someone from India (with a bad attitude) calling me from a New Jersey number for Chase. The same for my Comcast bill&#8230;I was paying that on-line but I was receiving snail mail bills. If I wasn&#8217;t on time with my payment they were going to put added charges onto the bill. I put that on automatic bill pay so I know that it is paid on time. I also make sure that I look at the online notice bill, make the proper payments and set it to pay before the due date. That way I know that it is applied to my bill. They are trying to get more money from you no matter what. We have to be diligent on stopping them!</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: barnegat48</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15553</link> <dc:creator>barnegat48</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 03:35:54 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15553</guid> <description>I agree with most of this post, but not for the same reasons.A few years ago when online bill payment was new, my car insurance premium fell through the cracks and wasn&#039;t paid by my payer. The company canceled my insurance immediately and didn&#039;t notify me, so I had to appear in court and pay a ticket when I was stopped for something else and had no current proof of insurance.The biggest obstacle for me is that I am paid every two weeks and I don&#039;t keep much cushion in my checking account. So if I set up payments to occur on the same day each month, there&#039;s a good chance they will bounce.I also had a scary experience when I had all my bills on e-bill and my computer died. For a month I had no idea what was due or when. Now I get the bills on paper and schedule them for online payment the day after my check is deposited. no muss, no fuss, no more problems.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with most of this post, but not for the same reasons.</p><p>A few years ago when online bill payment was new, my car insurance premium fell through the cracks and wasn&#8217;t paid by my payer. The company canceled my insurance immediately and didn&#8217;t notify me, so I had to appear in court and pay a ticket when I was stopped for something else and had no current proof of insurance.</p><p>The biggest obstacle for me is that I am paid every two weeks and I don&#8217;t keep much cushion in my checking account. So if I set up payments to occur on the same day each month, there&#8217;s a good chance they will bounce.</p><p>I also had a scary experience when I had all my bills on e-bill and my computer died. For a month I had no idea what was due or when. Now I get the bills on paper and schedule them for online payment the day after my check is deposited. no muss, no fuss, no more problems.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Busy Mom</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15540</link> <dc:creator>Busy Mom</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 23:00:13 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15540</guid> <description>Kevin,I read your post last night and TOTALLY agreed with you. I did not take the time to comment since I figured we were all on the same page. I guess not.I find errors every 2 or 3 months with our bills. There is NO WAY I would setup automatic payments for utilities, car payments, etc.I do use bill pay. After reviewing bills for accuracy, I assign a date (a few days ahead of time) for payment. My credit union has never missed a payment.Thanks for the post. In my book, Kevin, you are DEAD ON. I greatly appreciate your blog.Keep up the great work!</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin,</p><p>I read your post last night and TOTALLY agreed with you. I did not take the time to comment since I figured we were all on the same page. I guess not.</p><p>I find errors every 2 or 3 months with our bills. There is NO WAY I would setup automatic payments for utilities, car payments, etc.</p><p>I do use bill pay. After reviewing bills for accuracy, I assign a date (a few days ahead of time) for payment. My credit union has never missed a payment.</p><p>Thanks for the post. In my book, Kevin, you are DEAD ON. I greatly appreciate your blog.</p><p>Keep up the great work!</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Do You Dave Ramsey?</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15539</link> <dc:creator>Do You Dave Ramsey?</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 22:57:04 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15539</guid> <description>Hmm, I&#039;m still not 100% with you.  You know I love your work Kev, but I think this discussion isn&#039;t firing on all cylinders.There are 3 ways to handle bills... paper bills, electronic bills, and autopay...But to smooth the arc there are really 5 ways to handle billspaper bill - paper check paper bill - e-check e-bill - paper check e-bill - e-check autopayIf I understand correctly, you prefer paper bills to e-bills (regardless of how you choose to pay) and that you really like autopay provided personal accountability is still part of the mix.I can live with this but I find it helpful to acknowledge each of the variations.  I personally live at the extremes... give me all paper of automate the whole process - I don&#039;t want half baked solutions.I do exactly as you with my autopays and manual entry into a budget spreadsheet - only way to go in my mind.So, with that in place... we&#039;re of 1 mind to this point...Here&#039;s where I start to question...I&#039;m wondering why you have an attack mode going against the service providers.I&#039;ll take this in two parts.First - you have to realize that large corps are broken into and managed as either profit or cost centers.  If I run Billing Ops then I could care less about the Sales and Marketing teams.  A HUGE chunk of my budget is invoicing and payment processing... this requires a lot of mail and people.  If I can start to automate large % of my effort then I can have a great impact the costs I bring to the table.Sales and Marketing on the other hand have a different metric and budget... direct mails are a small % of their overall budget so removing it altogether would not move their cost meter but would impact their touches and conversions - profits.Second - you have to consider to which vendors you provide autopay access.  I can trust my power cooperative more than my credit card for example.I get your point about medical bills but for most all of us these are not recurring expenses and would not likley be set up for autopay.  Again, know who you&#039;re allowing access.The bottom line for us - and this is HUGE - is personal accountability.  If I&#039;m paper but don&#039;t balance my checkbook I&#039;m an idiot but the same goes if I&#039;m all electronic.Meanwhile, some companies have harsh or suspect policies but most of those (unless it&#039;s a credit card company where all bets are off) are in the sales tactics.  Most &quot;gotchas&quot; are going to come from a profit center like sames then from a cost center like billing.This is a great topic and I&#039;m glad you tackled it... I just think there are other moving parts.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, I&#8217;m still not 100% with you.  You know I love your work Kev, but I think this discussion isn&#8217;t firing on all cylinders.</p><p>There are 3 ways to handle bills&#8230; paper bills, electronic bills, and autopay&#8230;</p><p>But to smooth the arc there are really 5 ways to handle bills</p><p>paper bill &#8211; paper check<br /> paper bill &#8211; e-check<br /> e-bill &#8211; paper check<br /> e-bill &#8211; e-check<br /> autopay</p><p>If I understand correctly, you prefer paper bills to e-bills (regardless of how you choose to pay) and that you really like autopay provided personal accountability is still part of the mix.</p><p>I can live with this but I find it helpful to acknowledge each of the variations.  I personally live at the extremes&#8230; give me all paper of automate the whole process &#8211; I don&#8217;t want half baked solutions.</p><p>I do exactly as you with my autopays and manual entry into a budget spreadsheet &#8211; only way to go in my mind.</p><p>So, with that in place&#8230; we&#8217;re of 1 mind to this point&#8230;</p><p>Here&#8217;s where I start to question&#8230;I&#8217;m wondering why you have an attack mode going against the service providers.</p><p>I&#8217;ll take this in two parts.</p><p>First &#8211; you have to realize that large corps are broken into and managed as either profit or cost centers.  If I run Billing Ops then I could care less about the Sales and Marketing teams.  A HUGE chunk of my budget is invoicing and payment processing&#8230; this requires a lot of mail and people.  If I can start to automate large % of my effort then I can have a great impact the costs I bring to the table.</p><p>Sales and Marketing on the other hand have a different metric and budget&#8230; direct mails are a small % of their overall budget so removing it altogether would not move their cost meter but would impact their touches and conversions &#8211; profits.</p><p>Second &#8211; you have to consider to which vendors you provide autopay access.  I can trust my power cooperative more than my credit card for example.</p><p>I get your point about medical bills but for most all of us these are not recurring expenses and would not likley be set up for autopay.  Again, know who you&#8217;re allowing access.</p><p>The bottom line for us &#8211; and this is HUGE &#8211; is personal accountability.  If I&#8217;m paper but don&#8217;t balance my checkbook I&#8217;m an idiot but the same goes if I&#8217;m all electronic.</p><p>Meanwhile, some companies have harsh or suspect policies but most of those (unless it&#8217;s a credit card company where all bets are off) are in the sales tactics.  Most &#8220;gotchas&#8221; are going to come from a profit center like sames then from a cost center like billing.</p><p>This is a great topic and I&#8217;m glad you tackled it&#8230; I just think there are other moving parts.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Baker @ ManVsDebt</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15529</link> <dc:creator>Baker @ ManVsDebt</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 20:18:13 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15529</guid> <description>I agree with the point of this post.  For me, you don&#039;t miss a pay because an e-mail was sent to the wrong e-mail address.  The only way you miss that bill is if you aren&#039;t on a budget, paying attention to your current budget, or totally out of touch with your financial situation.  Sure, it would be nice to always getting the e-mail to remind, but you should be able to pay bills with out an e-mail reminder.How you end the articles hits the nail on the head.  It&#039;s impossible to autopilot 100% and even if you could it wouldn&#039;t be a good idea.  You have to have another system to catch something from falling through the cracks!Well done, sir!</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with the point of this post.  For me, you don&#8217;t miss a pay because an e-mail was sent to the wrong e-mail address.  The only way you miss that bill is if you aren&#8217;t on a budget, paying attention to your current budget, or totally out of touch with your financial situation.  Sure, it would be nice to always getting the e-mail to remind, but you should be able to pay bills with out an e-mail reminder.</p><p>How you end the articles hits the nail on the head.  It&#8217;s impossible to autopilot 100% and even if you could it wouldn&#8217;t be a good idea.  You have to have another system to catch something from falling through the cracks!</p><p>Well done, sir!</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Abigail</title><link>http://www.nodebtplan.net/2009/03/27/the-risk-of-automatically-paying-your-bills/comment-page-1/#comment-15512</link> <dc:creator>Abigail</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 17:32:30 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nodebtplan.net/?p=2302#comment-15512</guid> <description>Well, I still disagree with you about the root cause of the electronic billing. They&#039;d be sending out the offers anyway, so by at least making the statements electronic, they are still saving quite a bit of moolah.Still, I do hope this post helps a few people.At least for me, though, electronic billing actually helps me avoid late charges. I tend to let mail pile up. I see that it&#039;s a statement so I say I&#039;ll check it later. This way, I log in, check the balance, click once and look over a statement, and then make a payment. And in about 4 years of electronic billing, I&#039;ve never had a problem with a payment not going through. Perhaps I&#039;m just one of the lucky ones?I know Lauren said she and her partner have to tack the bill to the fridge... I find that it&#039;s simpler to just write the due date down on a calendar (generally a few days beforehand, so in case I procrastinate or forget to check for a couple days, I still have time).Finally, there&#039;s one surefire way to avoid missing payments. It&#039;s a favorite of mine: Make payments every time you get paid. At least a couple folks have written about this recently. You get to feel like you&#039;re making more progress more often. You&#039;re constantly aware of your balance and any due dates. And you will pretty much never miss a payment because at least twice a month you&#039;re paying the bills down.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I still disagree with you about the root cause of the electronic billing. They&#8217;d be sending out the offers anyway, so by at least making the statements electronic, they are still saving quite a bit of moolah.</p><p>Still, I do hope this post helps a few people.</p><p>At least for me, though, electronic billing actually helps me avoid late charges. I tend to let mail pile up. I see that it&#8217;s a statement so I say I&#8217;ll check it later. This way, I log in, check the balance, click once and look over a statement, and then make a payment. And in about 4 years of electronic billing, I&#8217;ve never had a problem with a payment not going through. Perhaps I&#8217;m just one of the lucky ones?</p><p>I know Lauren said she and her partner have to tack the bill to the fridge&#8230; I find that it&#8217;s simpler to just write the due date down on a calendar (generally a few days beforehand, so in case I procrastinate or forget to check for a couple days, I still have time).</p><p>Finally, there&#8217;s one surefire way to avoid missing payments. It&#8217;s a favorite of mine: Make payments every time you get paid. At least a couple folks have written about this recently. You get to feel like you&#8217;re making more progress more often. You&#8217;re constantly aware of your balance and any due dates. And you will pretty much never miss a payment because at least twice a month you&#8217;re paying the bills down.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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